topic RE: Backend application change monitoring in Product Forum

Backend application change monitoring

FélixGranados — Thu, 10 Dec 2020 05:52:00 GMT

Hi all,

I would like to start a discussion about one thing that I guess most of us (if not everybody) suffers from time to time. Sometimes robot execution terminates because the backend application where the robots tries to execute the process (SAP, web application...) has changed and then we need to recalibrate the robot again.

The position we have in general about this issues is just reactive, we wait until the application change, the robot crash and then we fix it but I would like to have a more proactive approach. The options I see are the next:

1) Speak with IT and other stakeholders so we are informed about future changes: In few cases is an option but, in general, simply there are too many changes to use this option broadly
2) To use a "monitoring robot" that test the applications before the the real robots are executed. Is an option but maybe too manual
3) To use a commercial tool design for this feature: This would be great but I´m not aware of any exiting tool

So what I would like to ask is, how do you face this situation? Do you use any of the previous options? any other option?

Best regards,
Félix

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Félix Granados
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

John__Carter — Thu, 10 Dec 2020 11:06:00 GMT

Hi Felix - this has always been a problem with no easy answer. Your point (1) is critical - the business is benefiting from RPA, so the risk/impact/cost of change needs to be understood, acknowledged and mitigated. Getting people to appreciate what application updates could mean to the business is a big first step, then a joint mitigation plan can be devised. On the one hand business applications have to be kept up to date, but this could mean additional time and effort to retrain the digital workers.

Knowing when updates are coming is a big help, and if IT can provide an pre-release in a sandbox environment, then the RPA team can investigate the impact of the update, and given enough time, make any changes necessary. Alternatively, maybe the digital workforce could be (temporarily) excluded from application updates in order to give the RPA team time to accommodate the updates.

However, for 3rd party applications this advanced warning is probably not possible, and the only option is to try to detect changes that have already been made. Perhaps a test process could be scheduled to check that the application integration is still working and report any problems. This is unlikely to require constant monitoring as in (2) and maybe once a week is sufficient, and perhaps at night or at the weekend.

If a 3rd party app is known to change often, then this needs to included in the analysis of a potential RPA project. If business requirements demand an aggressive SLA or a low tolerance for downtime, then maybe the anticipated effort to maintain an automation for this app makes the project unsuitable for RPA.

Here at BP we are giving this difficult problem some thought, and wondering if in the future digital workers could have the ability to automatically adapt to change.

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John Carter
Professional Services
Blue Prism
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

FélixGranados — Thu, 10 Dec 2020 16:32:00 GMT

Hi John,

Thanks for your comments. I think that thru coordination with Business and IT will be able to detect in advance big changes (so far we are doing...sometimes) but minor changes that happens in the backend hundred of times per day are not going to be detect before they happen.

Being frankly the only option I see (until the robots are able to adapt themselves) is to use technology, either another robot or commercial monitoring tools. Are you aware are of any of these solutions being implemented?

Thanks,
Félix

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Félix Granados
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

PritamPoojari — Fri, 11 Dec 2020 14:46:00 GMT

Hi

If the UI is changing that frequently maybe worth considering if you can integrate using API or backend systems, if that option exists.

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Pritam Poojari
Solution Architect
Capgemini
Europe/London
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

FélixGranados — Fri, 11 Dec 2020 14:59:00 GMT

Hi Pritam,

Thanks to reply. When I mention so huge number of changes is related with the full IT landscape where we have deployed our robots (no just one application). So the question is how do you deal with all the changes that happens in the backend. Do you have a reactive position or you are able to be more proactive?

Best regards,

Felix

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RE: Backend application change monitoring

PritamPoojari — Fri, 11 Dec 2020 15:27:00 GMT

Hi Felix

I understand what you mean now.
In terms of proactive , like John mentioned our clients handle it by communicating with different dev teams, and testing against test versions of those systems.
It also depends on how the automation has been built, where in it can handle changes minor changes.
Unfortunately there is no silver bullet and sometimes we do have to react to changes and respond accordingly.

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Pritam Poojari
Solution Architect
Capgemini
Europe/London
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

John__Carter — Fri, 11 Dec 2020 15:43:00 GMT

Hi Felix - to me, 'minor changes...hundred of times per day' suggests that the environment is not really suitable for RPA. At present digital workers are not flexible enough to deal with such a level of disruption and are at their best in a stable and predictable environment. The drive towards intelligent RPA will improve things but robots are a long way from being as adaptable as humans.

My advice would be to try to minimise change imposed on the digital workforce, rather than try to cope with it.

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John Carter
Professional Services
Blue Prism
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

FélixGranados — Sat, 12 Dec 2020 06:08:00 GMT

Hi John,

At the end, so many minor changes is what we may have in complex IT environment with hundreds of applications and we should deal with that (of course not all the applications change every day and some applications change more than others so the key is not to put in places robots in applications that change a lot or even that are going to suffer big changes in the next months) .What I was wondering is if somehow synthetic monitoring or even application performance management tools would may help us here but maybe the technical solution is to create a robot to do that kind of monitoring.

Thanks a lot for your help. I will keep the thread open few days more in order to see if there is any other comment but I guess the answer is clear: communication with stakeholders in order to prevent or at least detect in advance changes (business and IT mainly), implement robots only over the most stable applications and finally (and this is my opinion) to do synthetic monitoring with the help of a robot checking the applications where you have robots that either are critical or not run not frequently.

Thanks,

Félix



	*Félix Granados Sanandrés* HUB RPA
( 917532476 * fgranadoss@repsol.com

RE: Backend application change monitoring

John__Carter — Mon, 14 Dec 2020 10:28:00 GMT

Hi Felix - please keep us updated on your progress via this thread. I think you are right, and that a combination of the 3 approaches is required - awareness and coordination with the business and application owners, stabilising and controlling the RPA environment as much as possible, and proactively monitoring for application changes. Sometimes the monitoring can be a simple as checking the version number of the application - as minimum that can tell you to make further checks.

Lastly, you may be aware that BP has a Spanish entity now and they may be able to help you directly.

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John Carter
Professional Services
Blue Prism
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RE: Backend application change monitoring

FélixGranados — Mon, 14 Dec 2020 11:04:00 GMT

Hi John,

Of course I know José Manuel and Carlos. I discussed briefly this situation with them and they are looking for more information but I wanted to know also the experience from other customers or experts.

Thanks,

Felix

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RE: Backend application change monitoring

AmiBarrett — Mon, 14 Dec 2020 15:28:00 GMT

The statement of "minor changes...hundred of times per day" jumps out to me as well, but it does make me wonder if it's more a result of the application being generated in a dynamic fashion and/or if the use of dynamic/wildcard attributes in the application modeler would get around this. I suppose it depends on how "minor" these application changes are.

Likewise, I would wonder if there are enough consistent identifiers available to toss out the filters causing issues. Sometimes an alternate spy mode (AA/UIA) can be more useful/reliable.

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Ami Barrett
Automation Developer, Team Lead
Blue Prism
Plano, TX
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